The Call - Answered.

Last month I put out a call to my mailing list - an opportunity to celebrate creatives with an interview.

Join my mailing list to find out more cool stuff here:

Snail Mail

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So, today we celebrate the wonderful
​

Chloe Chicarelli​

Artist, Muralist, Graphic Designer & Illustrator based in Dayton, Ohio

Chloe-

"Everything you need is within you. I wish every woman would give themselves the grace to listen to their body... I will put care, attention, love, and devotion into what I do. I don't really care for money - I could do this as a philanthropy thing. But we gotta eat.

I think little me would be really happy that I'm doing something that's just me. I didn't even know I would live this long or make it this far."

You can either watch, listen or read the interview below - or all 3 if you like!

The Blog Version:

I feel I simply have to preface this with the biggest thank you to Chloe.
She jumped right in, whole hearted- wonky mic, technical difficulties and all.
The honesty and humour she answered my questions with is worth its weight in gold.
​Thank you my 'big tumbleweed of emotion'.
​You can see that integrity shine through in her work at:

Chloe Chicarelli . com

Social links:

Chloe at work on the 'Twilight' mural.

The short version:

Q: What was your favourite project?
A: The "Twilight" mural for the Juvenile Court system. "It was my second ever mural, and honestly one of the most humbling experiences. I worked with kids who were in tough situations, and giving them a creative outlet was incredible." I loved orchestrating the project and being able to work with a local famous artist's design.

Q: How do you push through tough days?
A: "I follow this quote by Abraham Lincoln: 'Leave nothing for tomorrow which can be done today.' If I'm lazy today, I'll pay for it tomorrow. It can become a knock-on effect that leads to burnout." I also try to listen to my body and understand my own feminine energy cycles.

Q: What made you say yes to creative opportunities?
A: "Why the fuck not? I'm at the point in my life where I take opportunities I'm presented with - even if they feel weird and wild and some scary." I want to support other artists and believe we can all succeed together.

Q: What would your younger self think about your current work? A: "I think she'd be really happy that I'm doing something that's just me. I didn't even know I would live this long or make it this far. I keep seeing milestones, and it's really cool that I keep pushing and making cool stuff."

Q: What do you wish people knew about your creative process?
A: "I wish people would appreciate the care, attention, love, and devotion I put into my work. I hate talking about money, but we've got to eat. When people say 'I could do that,' I say, 'Go on then.'" I want people to understand the real work behind creating art.

Q: What's been your biggest creative journey moment?
A: "It's been more of a slow burn. Every little thing I've done has built up. Now I'm at a point where people tag me in projects, and I'm building a reputation." Moving to America gave me a chance to become the person I know I am.
​
Q: What's your ultimate goal?
​A: "I want people to smile. I mean, somebody almost crashed their car yesterday just looking at my work - that's the ultimate compliment!"

The grab a coffee and settle back version -
If you prefer to read and take in some more peaceful media.

​

Zoe Davey  0:00  
Hi, welcome to the first video of this type on this channel. It is linked to a blog. And if you've been following my creative journey recently, you'll know that I've been making a blog every single Friday, and recently, I reached out to my mailing list because I knew there's some wonderful creative people on there that I wanted to hear from, and figure that other people might want to hear from too. And and someone replied, It was Chloe, and I was so pleased, and I'll always be so pleased and thankful for her being the first interviewee. Enjoy the interview. It's long. We go off on tangents, but I love to listen to that kind of stuff where creatives talk to other creatives. They go off on tangents, and they don't apologize for it. I've done the best I can with the audio. It will get better in time, but for now, is what it is. It's scrappy. I've done the best I can with it. I've really enjoyed this interview. We talk about what you tell her younger self about what she's doing now, we talk about what her favourite projects were, and why they were her favourite projects, and how she pushes through on the really difficult times. It's heart-warming, it's wonderful, and I hope you really enjoy it. And now there's just one more message from me before we carry on. So it turns out, if you screen record a phone call, it doesn't necessarily record the audio. So this is the video of me apologizing for not being in the corner of the screen because I turned my camera off by accident and the audio doesn't work. So we live and we learn. That's what I'm going to say.

We'll get better from our mistakes.

Chloe C  1:32  
Lady, right. We are going to make an attempt at an introduction. Okay, this is the first one of these, my honoured guest, Chloe Chicarelli, here she is all the way from America. Thank you for being the first one. Thank you for being

Always down to be your test guinea pig, whatever you need. I love this. This is so awesome, amazing.

Zoe Davey  2:01  
Um, we've basically got how many questions are we doing today? We are doing eight whole questions. But the amount of me and you like to talk this is going to be, like, six hours long. So buckle in, everyone.

Chloe C  2:14  
Shut me up if I start yapping.

Zoe Davey  2:19  
No that's the point. Is, if I'm yapping too much. I need to be reined in, because I'm the one that's supposed to ask the questions and then shut up.

Chloe C  2:26  
That's fine. I am definitely more of the listener in a relationship than us than the talker. So...

Zoe Davey  2:32  
Well, it's your turn to have the spotlight put on you. I don't know how you feel about that. Try well, for anybody who doesn't know Chloe, she is a mural artist and general creative person, I will link her stuff on her website, because it looks amazing. My favorite piece, I think that you've done, I've written it down here so I didn't forget was the Downtown Box. Like it's a huge side of the building with the birds in it, and they're like the Heron, yep. It's amazing. That's really nice colors. And that's the picture that I'm going to put in there. 

Chloe C  3:10  
A little segue into question one. Then, fantastic.

Zoe Davey  3:15  
I didn't even plan that. That's perfect. Let's what is question one. Question one is, what's your favourite project you've ever worked on? And why? 

Chloe C  3:23  
Oh, my goodness, crazy. Yeah. So Twilight, that one was called, and it's actually the biggest project that I've done to date. And funnily enough, it was only my second ever mural. So I used to work a nonprofit in downtown Dayton, and I just completed the first one. They just kind of said, Hey, did anybody want to do this mural? Nobody really wanted to paint it. The design had made. So it was already like, ready to go. And I was like, I'll do it.

Zoe Davey  3:59  
That's the dream, there, right? 

Chloe C  4:01  
Like, you're pretty good at this. I'm like, thank you. Like, any other opportunities that you've got, like, thrown my way, I'd absolutely love that. Definitely no money. This was, this was before. This was definitely getting my experience. Yeah. So yeah, the owner just approached me one day, and she was like, Hey, we're going to be doing a really big project. Would you like to be the lead muralist? And like, no hesitation. I was just like, let's go. And then she kind of proceeded to, you know, go. Just explain a little bit more about what that would all entail. It was actually a program with the Montgomery County Juvenile court system. So they it's juvie kids, you know, just under 18, kids who have, you know, maybe kind of done something they shouldn't have. They're in bad situations. It was one of them. Most like humbling things I've ever done. So they have a project called the halo project, which is helping adolescents achieve long term objectives. So it just gave these kids, you know, something to do that kept them out of trouble. A lot of them were, like, really, really good artists, and they just, you know, I'm so happy that they finally had something where they could be themselves. It was a little bit scary. I'm not gonna lie, I had a couple of like, 18, 17 year olds who were like, I'm a run. I'm a run every day. And I'm like, please don't run. I've got so much of the stuff that I have to do with this, but it was such an eye opener. I was the lead muralist on that one, so I kind of really got to understand, like, the inner workings of it all, you know, like, I didn't get too much into the budget side of things, but just kind of like all the working parts and everything that it takes to make something like that go and I just, I loved it. I loved being able to orchestrate stuff, you know, getting out there doing actual work. The design was actually done by a local, famous artist called gay Hilton. So I was just like, super stoked to be doing her work, getting it all done. It was, it was really good. It really could, really cool, really good, really cool. 

Zoe Davey  6:34  
You can see it on your website, and that that side of the building is absolutely massive as well. I think you've got, like, a panel over there and before and after.
I didn't know that they had been painting it with you as well. That's amazing. Like, I mean, to throw you in at the deep end, like, obviously you said yes, not only that, you you're also in charge of these people, making sure that they like, on task, doing their thing. And you nailed it anyway. No wonder it's your favourite.

Chloe C  6:53  
It was definitely stressful. It was literal blood, sweat and tears shed mostly, I was hoping, like heavy equipment and stuff. Yeah, it was a it was one of the most cool learning experiences, as stressful as it was, and lots of egos and personalities and stuff, it was none of that mattered. Like, the moment I had done that, every all the kids were only helping on, like, kind of, like, the block colours and stuff, I just remember there was a little bit of lettering in the bottom left corner, and that was, like, the last thing I was doing. And like, it's so crazy. Like, you start something that's so daunting, and then, like, you have that final brush stroke, and then you're like, Oh, I'm doing it so weird, all of that, all of that stress, and I finally just finished, and you're like, oh, oh, it's happened. I did it.

Zoe Davey  7:57  
It was so good. So, yeah, no, that's an amazing answer. Thank you so much. If this doesn't record, because this is our first time doing this. If this doesn't record, I'll just cry, because that was a wonderful answer, and people need to hear that, because I think it's it's really inspiring to hear the joy that comes out of doing things that aren't necessarily always broadcasted as like, job type. Isn't easy.

Chloe C  8:26  
I mean, there's a couple of things, ;)  but...

-dog barks - sorry, just making sure the dog was fed.

Zoe Davey  8:36  
Important things in life.

Chloe C  8:38  
...is that, yeah, no, I just You just gotta keep going. Just gotta keep pushing. It's really cool, even when things are hard, like, I guess this,

Zoe Davey  8:52  
Maybe then after we piggyback and we go on to Question three, because that would be a perfect segue. It's, How do you push through on a hard day? Okay? And then we can go back, unless you want to do question two?

Chloe C  9:05  
What is Question three?

Zoe Davey  9:10  
Question three is, how do you push through on a hard day when the going gets tough? What? What are your ways of pushing through?

Chloe C  9:18  
Um, so David actually has this quote that he says all the time, and it's really and I want to say this right? I'm going to try and say it, and then I'm going to make sure it's right. What is it? Leave nothing for tomorrow, which leave nothing for tomorrow, which can be done today. Abraham Lincoln, oh, we like that. And I really hold it like quite close to my heart, honestly, as I continue to, like do this and start to, you know, get deeper into this, I'm a solo artist. I. Uh, the work comes out of my hands. Like, yes, there's times where I have assistance and they can do, you know, block colouring and stuff like that. But whatever I don't do today, if I want to be lazy today, I'm going to pay for that tomorrow. Yeah, I and it can really start to become a knock on effect, and that really affects me with burnout. So, yeah, I I am. It's kind of funny, like, I do feel like quite a lazy girl at heart, and it is hard to kind of push through sometimes when all you want to do is just go home and just, like, watch something on Netflix. But I just, I just know that if I don't do it today, it's tomorrow's problem, and then that will be the next day's problem. And it kind of like weirdly pushes me to keep going. It just makes me do that extra, you know, that extra 20 minutes that tomorrow, you know, and 20 minutes every single day you've lost another hour. And then, you know, that's that Friday feeling when I want to actually go home. I've kind of been through that. So I guess it's all about just trying to find the balance, listening, obviously, to your body. And I guess this does actually kind of go into like question four as well. Yes, yes, like that. I'm getting older. My body is not getting younger. I'm trying to get fitter right now. I'm trying to be better about listening to my body, but it really has been a game changer, especially for women. Following your cycle, I think is one of the most important things that you can do, because me, in my luteal phase, all I want to do is scream and cry. I don't want to be understanding to be I don't want to be dealing with bugs. I don't want to, you know, think no matter what industry you're in, I definitely think women should do that, because we are absolutely beating ourselves raw trying to keep up with men who have cortisol levels that get reset every 24 hours. We're just different creatures. And I just, I wish that every woman would give themselves the grace that I'm a bit of a hypocrite. I don't always do this. I sometimes have headlines, you know, I sometimes have to push a little bit harder. But if I could preach from the mountain tops, listen to your body. Listen to when you need rest, listen to what hurts and what you can do. You know it's like, oh yes, self care. It's just some face masks that's put some conditioning treatment on our hair. It's so much deeper than that. It's listening then checking in with yourself. Every single day, I find myself often, and more often than not, like, in a bad mood and trying to figure out the the core of that is it my body saying, oh, I need, I need to rest. Oh, my body's like, irritated, like, everything that you need is within you. I feel like, and maybe I sound like a crazy, crazy lady at this point, but like

Zoe Davey  13:01  
I'll join you!

Chloe C  13:03  
Your body knows what it needs. And I am really trying to, like, yesterday, it we had tornado warnings yesterday, and it was crazy. And I just said, okay, my body needs to rest. And I even joke about it. It's my forced relaxation. I sit there, and I will make myself just sit there, and it's like, I just wait for my body to, like, soak in and just appreciate it. I also think there's a lot of like, good with like, meditation and all that kind of stuff as well. But that's a whole 'nother. That's a whole 'nother conversation. I like it, though. Just take care of is that so obviously, yourself, learn how to listen to your body and then actually listen to your body, and then actually do the things that your body kind of needs you to do before everybody else who's up at 5am and doing this and drinking this and doing everything that's so good like Do what makes you happy? Sometimes I'm barely surviving, so

Zoe Davey  14:04  
We're just doing our best.

Perfect. Well, what was, Oh, we're going back to two then what were the biggest challenges you faced on that project? So we kind of covered them going back to the first mural project. But what was the biggest challenge for you? Do you think 

Chloe C  14:24  
Bugs.

Zoe Davey  14:28  
 Bugs?!

Chloe C  14:30  
So many bugs. There's so many spiders, outdoors, outdoors, flying creatures and like, I don't really care for them, but it was just constantly. No, that was that was definitely not ideal, obviously painted in summer, when the lights come on at night, it's 

Zoe Davey  14:58  
Oh,my God. I. Had not even considered that that's wild. I did paint outside for pretty much the first time with acrylics the other day, and there were a few, but I imagine over there, it is a little bit Wilder.

Chloe C  15:13  
I was led over to America. Was not informed about them - horrendous.

Zoe Davey  15:18  
God damn it, David, you didn't inform her?

Amazing. What made you say yes to the first mural or creative or creative opportunity that you did? What made you say yeah?

Chloe C  15:33  
Can I swear?

Zoe Davey  15:34  
Yeah.

Chloe C  15:34  
 Why the fuck not? Yeah?

Zoe Davey  15:38  
 I agree.

Chloe C  15:39  
 I just, I'm, at that point in life, like I'm a take opportunities. I, you know, we get presented with these weird and wild things every day, and some of them can feel scary. Some of them, one right now, yeah, like this is literally to be on podcasts and stuff. And I'm just like, I am not. 

Zoe Davey  16:03  
Well, you clearly are. You're doing some great answers.

Chloe C  16:08  
And if I can do something that benefits other people as well, but women like, it's kind of funny around here late. I mean, there's, there's a lot of artists who have a lot of egos, and that's like a global thing, but just trying to find people who have, like, similar mindsets, and just, we all got to eat. We all want to eat. Why can't we all eat? You know, it's like, I really want to support everybody, and it doesn't have to be like, this petty thing and like so just fucking vibe, and we all have different skill sets. Let's come together. 

Zoe Davey  16:44  
-sings- Yes, collaborate and listen.

Chloe C  16:49  
Yes. Why not? 

Zoe Davey  16:54  
Indeed. 

Number six, we're firing through these. I'm going to check what time we're on. What time are we on? It doesn't tell you we're in the zone. Excellent. What? Where's my I can't read number six. What do you-This is my favorite little question that came up with- what do you think little you as in, like you as I don't know, maybe like 6, 7, 8, would say about the work you do now?

Chloe C  17:22  
You know, I got a little bit like, when I read your questions, I like, a little bit teared. I thought that one, oh, I think she'd just be really happy that she's doing something that's just me. You know, I just feel like we all again, we take these opportunities in life. And I got to a point, you know, had my fancy corporate job, everything was good, but I just wasn't happy. I just wasn't where I thought I wanted to be in life, and I didn't know where I wanted to be. I spent my life just thinking I'd be kind of a bit of just a floater. I've never really had like a secure friendship group. I've got my family and stuff, but I've just always been a bit of a lone wolf, so I knew that whatever I did do, I needed that to kind of fill that little bit that I always felt safe, and I've always felt safe when I'm on my own, because I only have to worry about myself, and that's clearly some therapist talk. 

Zoe Davey  18:25  
I'll make a note of that one down for you.

Chloe C  18:31  
I think she'd be really proud. I didn't, I didn't even know I would live this long. Yeah, think I'd make it, and I keep seeing milestones, and it's it's really cool, and I keep pushing, and I keep making cool stuff, and I keep doing cool stuff, so better not stop now.

Zoe Davey  18:53  
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being really honest with that answer. You could have just said anything, and you gave me your heart.

Chloe C  19:00  
And that was because you said it my whole body -visibly wiping tears-

Zoe Davey  19:05  
Well, that's how you know it's true. That's how you know it's the good stuff. Yeah. So what do you wish more people knew about the process behind your work?

Chloe C  19:19  
Everything?

Just just the care, attention, love, devotion, that I will put into what I do, like I don't. There's not many things unless, like, you're a real prick to me. I'm going to give you my everything. Like you really have to, like, be an asshole to me, for me to, like, start not giving you my fault. Yeah. Wait, what was the question again, my brain just...

Zoe Davey  19:50  
 I think the question was, what do you wish people knew? Yeah, what do you wish more about the process behind it?

Chloe C  19:56  
Yeah, just the work that goes in behind. Scenes, the admin, the putting in every single receipt that I've ever spent on any kind of pain, figuring out how to be a business owner, because this is my first year full time. I still don't really know what I'm doing, but I'm figuring it out every day, and...

Zoe Davey  20:21  
...clearly something's working.

Chloe C  20:24  
I just wish people would give me the support and appreciate artists and the time and effort that does go in, because I will forever wear mug across my forehead. If I could do everything for free, I would, yeah.

Zoe Davey  20:38  
But we can't. We can't eat that way.

Chloe C  20:42  
I could do this, like, just as a philanthropy thing, that would be awesome. Maybe one day, that is where, maybe one day, because I hate talking about money, but we gotta eat.

Zoe Davey  20:53  
We have to eat, we have to pay for houses. We have to put clothes on our bags because we get arrested otherwise, you know? 

Chloe C  21:00  
Yeah, I guess that's the thing. A lot of people come to me and go, Well, I could do that. And I'm like, Well, go on. And then, well, you know, the cost of this, the cost of that, the cost of that, they can't seem to think of all the things like I, I was painting a mural, what, three days ago, and a guy came over. He was a general contractor, and I had four brushes laying on the floor. He was like, why have you got $200 just spilled out on the floor like that? And I went, Oh, you actually understand the value of things. 

Zoe Davey  21:36  
That's really cool, my friend, I saw something in my friend's story the other day that was like someone had asked, like, oh, you're a photographer. Do you just do that for fun or whatever? And then it was like, No, I just go to places with 300 300 Wait, 3000 pounds worth of equipment just hanging off me and try and make friends with toddlers for fun. No, of course, it's my job. But yeah, it's like when someone realizes how either how much time something takes, how much something costs, or how much effort and understanding and trial and error, how many times you failed before you got to that point when they recognize that, oh, that's a good day. That's a nice day. That's almost better than a pat on the back. It's a I see, I see what's going on here.

Chloe C  22:26  
I do. I mean, like, when I do my abstract stuff, a lot of people, that's where you really start to get the oh, well, I could do that. 

Zoe Davey  22:33  
Like, what the pain pouring thing, it looks amazing?!

Chloe C  22:36  
Just abstract work in general. Like, yeah, sometimes stuff only does take me two hours, and, yeah, charge you $1,000 for it, because that's how many times before, years and years and years learning all these different things to get me to that point. And it's just like anything. I just wished artists were kind of treated like general contractors. That's kind of where I feel in the same vein, yeah, yeah. 

Zoe Davey  23:05  
Never questioned a plumber. Never questioned a plumber in my life.

Chloe C  23:09  
Weird, isn't it? I can't believe we've made

Zoe Davey  23:12  
It has come to the last question, but we have, is there a moment in your creative journey that changed everything for you. 

Chloe C  23:23  
I was thinking about really, like trying to think of like something profound,

Zoe Davey  23:32  
It's okay, if there's nothing.

Chloe C  23:35  
I think it's kind of been like a slow burn more than anything. Yeah, I feel like every single little thing that I've done, I mean, I will say that working at the nonprofit, opened up a lot of doors, met a couple of people. I mean, yeah, just definitely, just through the years, just kind of, you know, building it up, building it, building it up. And like, now I'm at a point where, like, I'll go on Facebook every day and somebody's tagged me about a project, and like, I feel like just getting that reputation. And, yeah, you know, it's, I could lose that reputation in one day. I could do something, say something like, you know, cancel culture, like, and as a 90s baby, it can, it can be hard sometimes to find, like, where the wokeness is, and like what I can and can't say. I feel like, since moving to America, I was kind of given a, like, a bit of a second chance. I got to become the person that I know I am without all the past and everybody else's opinions and all that kind of stuff, you know, and it made me realize that I am a good person, and I want to do good in the world. And since that really it's just motivated me to want to do more. And I think within. Motivation comes that, you know, just it tumble. It's a big Tumbleweed of feelings and emotions to it.

Zoe Davey  25:11  
Doesn't have to be a movie moment right?

Chloe C  25:13  
 Sometimes, on and on and on, little meet cute, where everything just kind of went. You're a magical artist. 

Zoe Davey  25:21  
It's now, like, congratulations, but like, it's today, you're a magical artist. 

Chloe C  25:26  
Now, I feel like I've worked really hard over the like, I mean, I went to art school, I did all that good. 

Zoe Davey  25:36  
You did.

Chloe C  25:38  
Everything has just come out to this point where it was supposed to be. And again, I'm floating in a random country, in a random town, and my name's on buildings, and it's just, it's bizarre, but amazing. So yeah, definitely no magic firework moment, just a nice little slow Ember that's growing, and I hope it just keeps growing, because we should I want this to go to glow, glow forever with a because you're glowing right now, because this is so bright, the sun's just come out for the first time.

Zoe Davey  26:15  
Oh my gosh. Um, thank you. Thank you. That's not going to cover it. It's not going to cover it. It's it because, like, you need the people in your life who take a chance, and you take a chance of me all the time, so and now you're doing this for me. A special wish that this recorded properly. Wish with me. Ready? Please, please, please. -Chloe wishes, fingers crossed, on camera-. And then I had the little thing pop up that was like, You need to upgrade if you want to do 10 more minutes worth of speaking. I was like, I think the takeaways from this will be so lovely, because you've been so honest and so just full of joy about it all. And I think that shines through at the end of the day, even though things get really rough and like life is trying. Like, the thing that keeps shining through is that you love doing this stuff, and you love making beautiful things for people. And like, if you can keep doing that, then you're gonna pretty happy be

Chloe C  27:17  
I wanna, I want people to smile. Like, I mean, somebody almost crashed the car yesterday, and a policeman went like the wrong way yesterday, just because they're looking at my work and I that's one thing of a town where I don't think people understand general laws, but that's okay.

Zoe Davey  27:39  
I mean, that's a high compliment

Chloe C  27:41  
Oh God, Ohio now.

Zoe Davey  27:44  
So I think we'll carry on. Go, go.

Chloe C  27:50  
You inspire me again. The fact that you you have shown that you know, just because it doesn't always go the way you want it to the first time. Like tenacity, Zoe is it's all inspiring. It really we're doing this. Like, I just, we all have like things that we can, like, look up to, and like, just, I don't know, I love your style. I love how you can just bash it out and not overthink stuff, like everything that like, I wished I could do, like you just do it. You don't worry. You just do how do

Zoe Davey  28:28  
Oh how do you a how do you know I don't worry? You interview me one day. I'll tell you!

Chloe C  28:34  
You finished a painting. Zoe, 

Zoe Davey  28:37  
Oh, that is true.

Chloe C  28:38  
 I have ones, but I can finish them.

Zoe Davey  28:41  
But I'll get on you after we finish this, this interview, in a second, I'll harass you about finishing some art. How about that?

Chloe C  28:47  
Yeah, I mean, I'm getting my studio space set up right now, so I'm kind of, I can't wait to see that journey and where that all goes and my canvases have gone so like that's happening in the next you fully, fully talked, amazing, right? 

Zoe Davey  29:04  
Where can people find you if they don't know who you are or they don't already follow you? 

Chloe C  29:08  
They can find me on Facebook, on Instagram and Chloe Chicarelli Instagram at, just at, it's just because I sometimes put stuff on Tiktok. I am not the biggest social media girl.

Zoe Davey  29:25  
Want to we'll get there. You're a great example of someone who is bossing it without having to completely follow the norm. So that's okay. If there's people out there who are like, I don't know it, you're in that boat too, and you're still smashing it. 

Chloe C  29:41  
So okay, as the ex social media manager, I don't want to, I don't want to be there. And if you mural, I am International, you can go on my website, submit request, www.chloechicarelli.com,

Zoe Davey  29:57  
Oh my gosh. I want to see where this leads. I'm very curious. Trying to edit like that. All right, we're gonna end it now. Thank you for listening to everyone. Bye.

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Thank you so much for reading.
​This interview will always hold a special place in my heart.